Stock troubles

Information on Malfunctions and Care of your Model 8 & 81
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deerslap
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Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2015 2:30 pm

Stock troubles

Post by deerslap » Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:56 am

Well I took apart my 81 for the first time to clean it and all went well putting it together after some trial n error. But as I get to the last step of putting the shoulder stock back on I get hung up.
As I slip the stock on the rear of the receiver it slides on all the way except about a 1/16" from wood to metal. Just enough that I cant get the stock screw to grab the threads. I've tapped the rear with a nylon hammer but not to hard from fear of cracking it. I've pressed down hard as to get it to touch metal but The screw still wont catch threads and I can see the bottom tang not going all the way to the wood, near the round portion of the bottom tang. As soon as I release pressure the stock pops out again 1/16" to a 1/8".
I can't figure it out. I've checked for obstructions in the stock but found nothing. Can anyone give me some direction on how to get my stock on?

Thanks for putting up with my confusion,

deerslap

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Sarge756
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Location: N.Florida on the coast

Re: Stock troubles

Post by Sarge756 » Thu Apr 23, 2015 1:59 pm

I`m sure others that have had the same issue will offer some advice. We discussed this awhile back with a member that was looking for a replacement for his stripped screw. Caution with those screws is needed cause the fine threads will strip out rather quickly if misaligned. The bottom tang as you have discovered is sprung slightly and will prevent the holes lining up properly. My method is to use a C-clamp with thick leather pads to hold the stock and tang in position after tapping it with a rubber mallet to line them up. Check the alignment with a drift of suitable size to help with the alignment.Hope that will work for you.
Joe
".......ain't many troubles that a man cain't fix
With seven hundred dollars and a thirty ought six."

deerslap
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Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2015 2:30 pm

Re: Stock troubles

Post by deerslap » Thu Apr 23, 2015 6:32 pm

Thanks for the info Joe, Ill keep trying. It just seems to not go fully into battery, I get it a hair line away pushing on it but still cant get that tight metal to wood fit to allow me to line up the screw n threads. At this rate I'm hesitant to take apart my other 81s.
Steve

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Phyrbird
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Re: Stock troubles

Post by Phyrbird » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:29 pm

Steve,
is it an early Ser# 81? I found 2 early production rifles with the same problem. Investigating discovered a spring like action the last 1/8th to 1/4" to seat the buttstock. Tried lots of checks, it turned out the hole for the spring tube going into the stock was not as deep :shock: on the early stocks. It measures different! I used a correct diameter auger bit to remove a half turn at a time, checking every half turn. It worked :!: :!:
The screw hole on one of the two rifles lines up now with no further mods.

Sarge is very correct to be extremely careful about messing up those threads. If the threads in the receiver get damaged I'll give you three guesses how much luck you will have finding a tap :?: :?: :oops: :cry:
Last edited by Phyrbird on Sat Apr 25, 2015 6:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Phyrbird
SOKY

deerslap
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Re: Stock troubles

Post by deerslap » Fri Apr 24, 2015 7:40 am

Phyrbird,
I believe your right. It is an earlier Ser# 81. That spring action you mention is exactly what is happening to the stock the last 1/8 to 1/4. I press it tight as to pop a vein in my head and as I release pressure on the stock it pops back. I had my suspicions about the depth of the holes in the stock but at the same time I was thinking, well it had to go on some way since I took it off. I'm guessing it must of been press fitted at the factory 77 yrs ago and the stock has swollen over the years and saturated with oils.

I'll be careful and give the auger a try, hopefully that will do it. I read you and Sarge loud n clear when it comes to the screw threads.
Thank you both for replying to my dilemma, I'll fill you all in on how it goes. It drives me nuts not being able to get it together and I have no intention on doing the walk of shame to a gunsmith with parts in my hand.

Thanks again,
Steve

deerslap
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Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2015 2:30 pm

Re: Stock troubles

Post by deerslap » Fri Apr 24, 2015 3:35 pm

OK, I got it on! I went with what Phyrbird said and took an auger to the recoil spring guide rod hole. A few turns did the trick but it was still a heavy press to get it to fit. I'd like to refinish the wood on the old 81 but damn, I don't want to go through that again. Thing is I believe in cleaning my firearms so I most likely will have it apart again.
Thanks again to you and Sarge for giving me the tips.

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Phyrbird
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Re: Stock troubles

Post by Phyrbird » Sat Apr 25, 2015 6:25 pm

Glad I could help, Steve. :D :geek:
Phyrbird
SOKY

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S and S HUNTCLUB
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Re: Stock troubles

Post by S and S HUNTCLUB » Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:08 pm

Hello, The problem you're having is most likely debris in the butt stock action spring hole.
Take a long straight faced screw driver and drop it in the action spring hole of the stock. With moderate pressure, spin the screw driver to loosen the excess debris that is at the base of the action spring hole of the butt stock. Then, remove the screw driver and tap on the side of the butt stock to remove the debris.
This is quite common on the 8' and 81's that have not been properly cleaned for decades sometimes.
It may take two or three + attempts to clear the action spring hole, of the debris that has built up over the years.
Test fit the butt stock, making sure that it's fitting snugly against the back of the receiver, before attempting to reinstall the butt stock screw.
Don't force the stock mounting screw and take your time.
In the past, after installing the butt stock, I've had to set the rifle in a vertical position on the butt plate and apply downward pressure to install the mounting screw.
The problem you're having is not uncommon, but it sure can be frustrating.
Take your time and if need be, clean out the bottom of the action spring hole a bit more. Just use hand tools and if need be ... step away from the task, if it's not working out on the first few trys.
Lastly, check to make sure that you have crisp threads on your butt stock mounting screw. If need be, you can dress the mounting screw with a file, if the threads are burred up a bit.
Good luck!
Enjoy life, Bob at S and S HUNTCLUB

DirtyHarry44
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Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2017 4:33 pm

Re: Stock troubles

Post by DirtyHarry44 » Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:43 am

Yeah same problem here.
I've had the buttstock off a couple times after I bought it and it went back on with no trouble. ( Although the screw angle seems steep and takes muscle to get the last bit in with the screw head angling through the last little bit of the bottom tang.) after shooting it for the first time the damn screw don't wanna catch any threads. With the stock off the screw goes in like butter. Is it just me or do these treaded spring blocks seem at a very odd angle or off a bit.
I gotta gun store I run buy on Fridays and he said he would take a look, but damn if I wanna do this myself.
Is the stock supposed to have a small gap between the receiver or not, I can't recall.

Thanks for any help guys.

DirtyHarry44
Posts: 32
Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2017 4:33 pm

Re: Stock troubles

Post by DirtyHarry44 » Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:48 am

Second Q what's an Auger? Never heard of them for small tool use .
Looked them up and looks likes it rasps the outer edges of a hole. Don't the 81 stocks have a metal sleeve guiding the screw?
Sorry guys trying to soak up the knowledge.
Edit: You Guys are talking about using a tool to shorten the spring tube aren't you?
I don't recall any spring type action putting the stock on. I did try to file the mating surface of the stock for a while, but only little to no avail.
I guess I will see what my guy says.

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Phyrbird
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Re: Stock troubles

Post by Phyrbird » Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:34 pm

Auger: a wood boring bit, spiral, w/cutters that cut very smooth holes. (unless you break thru the back) No rasp here.

https://www.irwin.com/tools/browse/dril ... auger-bits

the hole referenced in our posts is the one the receiver tube for the recoil spring slides in the stock as you put the stock back on. Not the one for the screw.
Note if you look there may be a gap between the cheeks of the stock & the back of the receiver when it bottoms out. Sometimes the wood plug in the recoil spring tube hits the back of the hole B4 the receiver seats al the way.
Don't shorten the tube, it's aluminum, hard to locate any replacements, & some are brazed in place. An item we avoid messing with.
Be extra careful filing the stock mating surfaces, many a wrist crack got conceived when parts of a stock did not support recoil right. I've heard some old timers say they used cigarette papers as a check. Mate stock to the metal, if you can't pull the paper out the edges, it's right. one paper, move it around.
S&S is very correct; it is an issue that gunk accumulates in the back of the tube hole. many rifles are stored muzzle up that makes it worse. A5s are the same way.
Phyrbird
SOKY

chas1949
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Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:40 pm

Re: Stock troubles

Post by chas1949 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 8:11 am

First off you must take a common sense approach here. The rifle was together and functional before you disassembled to clean and service, so did you do anything that would affect reassembly of the butt stock to the receiver such as remove and reinstall the action spring tube? If not then butt stock should go back on as it was originally. The depth of the spring tube hole in the butt stock is designed as to push the action spring wooden plug flush into the tube when the stock is installed. The very small pin is not meant to retain the spring and plug when rifle is fired but only to retain in place til butt stock is installed.
Shortening the spring tube or drilling hole in stock deeper my allow easier assembly but will lead to failure of wood plug or pin that retains spring assembly as the design intends the butt stock to hold this together as the rifle functions. You should feel the action spring being compressed when you install the stock onto the receiver.
Some tend to be more difficult then others to put back together.

DirtyHarry44
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Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2017 4:33 pm

Re: Stock troubles

Post by DirtyHarry44 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 12:20 pm

Well I feel like a bonehead! (Face Smack). Went to a gunsmith, (Who was great btw, and is my guy from now on)
Fixed the prblem in 5 minutes. The stock needed compressed HARD to get the screw in, now she's back together!
Next ordeal is fixing the gouges in the pistolgrip from a cheap hollow ground screwdriver. (And my surmounting anger).
So the stock should be compressed on? I don't remember doin that before I shot it.
I guess shooting it and pulling the bolt spring and mag plate afterwards to clean it shook something loose.
Anything I should look at to make installation easier, or that's just the way thes springpoles are?

Thanks a million for all the help guys!

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