81 Magazine Rx

Information on Malfunctions and Care of your Model 8 & 81
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Rifleman
Posts: 242
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:07 pm

81 Magazine Rx

Post by Rifleman »

OK----Bought a low number Model 81 (prewar) rifle in 35 Rem. Upon looking it over noticed that the magazine indicator spring was out of its groove in the receiver. Removed the trigger group and magazine to get the T ended spring back in place, but as with alot of these old girls, it hadn't been cleaned in years. It was filthy, more so than my other two 81's, so I disassembled and gave everything a thorough cleaning and lubing.

I removed the magazine from the trigger frame and squirted some gun gunk removal and compressed air to clean it without disassembly, but the black ooze didn't seem to want to quit, so I took the follower and spring out of the magazine shell and cleaned the interior.

Problem--it seems so simple of a procedure, but I fail to find the proper trick into proper assembly. Just can't seem to get it right. HELP-How to I properly install spring and follower. I know the ends of the springs point to the rear (buttstock). Can't seem to get the follower in and in right. Help very much appreciated.
Last edited by Rifleman on Sat Apr 23, 2022 11:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
Rifleman
Posts: 242
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:07 pm

Re: 81 Magazine Rx

Post by Rifleman »

OK---I searched the web finding really no info. Searched this forum (via search function) not finding any exact instructions, so I went page by page on this section, 'Trouble Shooting/Maintenance' and found on the bottom of page 6 a thread posted on July 8, 2015 by 'cedarhillsupply' titled "Magazine Follower and Spring Removal', last post posted July 8, 2015 by Adam Lee.

Good informative post-followed info and pictures, but still the proper installation eludes me. Placing spring ends to the rear, hooking the right follower end to the end of the spring. What is causing me the most headache and frustration is I can't get the spring to properly seat into the magazine well. Doesn't want to seat down into the well right. Get the bottom end and lower spring bend into the well, but the top spring bend doesn't want to seat. One of the posters to the thread 'Johnhalf' gave written instructions and pictures. On one of the pictures showing reassembly, he states "When reassembling put the spring so that the ends face the back (wide side to the rear)". Understand putting the ends of the spring to the rear, but don't understand the "wide sides" bit of it. Both spring ends are the same width.

If I do get the top spring bend seated into the well, hook the follower onto the top end, I can't get it to seat and the lower spring bend wants to come up. The one time I did get everything in, the follower was sort of jammed half way down into the well. I don't want to force things and bend the spring and/or the follower. Please help---what am I doing wrong. I'm pretty mechanically inclined and understanding, but this has me baffled. Almost like wrong parts for wrong unit, but it was together before. Any help and info much appreciated.
chas1949
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Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:40 pm

Re: 81 Magazine Rx

Post by chas1949 »

Upper spring lower spring, the mag spring is one piece. Is your mag spring in two piecess
Rifleman
Posts: 242
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:07 pm

Re: 81 Magazine Rx

Post by Rifleman »

No it's one piece. Should have explained it better. What I was referring to was the two bends on the spring that go in the forward (towards barrel). When the spring is inserted into the mag well they are in the forward portion of the mag, there is a lower one and an upper one. Of course the two ends are pointed to the rear (stock) and there is a bent portion also between them. Hopes this explains my intention.
chas1949
Posts: 167
Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:40 pm

Re: 81 Magazine Rx

Post by chas1949 »

Mag spring
Mag spring
9FFF1918-D1FF-4982-B377-34DC5AECA88B.png (696.37 KiB) Viewed 2387 times



Like this, push spring in and tip follower slightly so it will go into mag then let follower tip flat and it will stay in place holding spring in.
Rifleman
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Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:07 pm

Re: 81 Magazine Rx

Post by Rifleman »

Thanks for the reply. Basically that's what I'm trying/attempting, but the spring just doesn't want to seat into the well. Seems like the Ol saying trying to fit a round peg into a sqaure hole. I'll have to work on it tomorrow afternoon.
Rifleman
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Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:07 pm

Re: 81 Magazine Rx

Post by Rifleman »

OK, Update on magazine. I tried to get the magazine back into working order as it should be reassembled. It would go together, but the follower would not compress into the magazine as it should. I took a mag spring from a 1947 era 81 and first noted it was different in appearance.

The '47 mag spring if viewed as a W had extra curved leafs at the top. The spring out of the 35 Rem looks like the letter W when viewed, but the spring out of the '47 300 Savage looks like a W with additional wings on the tips of the top of the W. I'm hoping to post several pictures of what I'm talking about. On page 43 of Henwoods book, item #57 (magazine spring), if you were to view it you could see what I'm referring to. The spring out of my '38 81 Rem 35 doesn't have those flared springs coming off of the top of the W. I also found a picture of some 81 parts a seller had for sale on GunsAmerica (past sale, ended). One of the parts was a magazine spring of the same shape/design as the one in Henwoods book.

The spring out of my 35 Remington 81 has longer leaf's also. The top and bottom end leaf's on the 35 Rem are 2 1/2" vs 2 3/8" from the '47 81 rifle, 1/8" longer. The length of the V leaf's for the '38 35 Rem are 2 11/16" vs 2 5/16" on the '47 rifle, 3/8" longer. Compressed length of each spring is 2 3/4" for the 1938 35 Rem vs 2 3/8" for the 1947 rifle, again 3/8" longer. Width is the same, 3/8". Also as previously noted, the '47 81's spring has the bent/flared extra leaf's on it. Also the '47 rifle spring has riveted sections at the bottoms if viewed as a W. Without taking it apart, I viewed into the mag well of my '49 era 81. From what I could see, it looked like the '47 era 81.

The '38 Model 81 when you try to compress the follower will bind. Looking into the mag well with the spring installed, I can see where the ends of the springs where they form a V are binding on the ends of the mag well. The overall length is a testament to that. About two cartridges is all that can be inserted. I took the '47 spring and installed it in the '38 mag well with its follower and worked as designed. I've come to the conclusion that someone, sometime needed a spring for this rifle and just installed the spring as it is a common design for alot of rifle magazines. I called and T/W the seller and he advised he sold the rifle as he bought it, didn't know the guy he bought it from other than was told he was selling a rifle his grandparent had had. The GB seller I bought it from advised he would be on the lookout for a proper spring.

I've contacted every gun part, vintage part seller, Ebay, Gun Broker, etc I could find on the net with no success. Several have my name/number if they run across one. Question, is the type of spring everyone has run across for 8/81 rifles of the type I have in my '47 81, ie. the W with extra flared leaf's on it, or are some of the type of W as was in my '38 81 that just looks like a W? In Henwoods book, the spring in the parts photo (page 24) is of the same W with flares on the ends for a Model 8. I hope to get my photo's downloaded here. Several other attempts in the past have failed. NOTE::: If anyone has a proper 8/81 magazine spring that you would part with, I'm very much interested. Thank you--- Rifleman
(NOTE: Tried to insert pictures, not sure what problem is-click on 'image' function at top of page, but my 'pictures' saved on my computer won't show. :( Hope my written description tells the story!
Rifleman
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Re: 81 Magazine Rx

Post by Rifleman »

Reference Rem 8/81 mag spring design, I did find on page 56 of Henwoods book that most 8/81 springs are of the 6 leaf design. Some are riveted at two junctions, others at all five. My 6 leaf '47 era spring is riveted at the two lower junctions. Henwood also wrote that there were some four blade mag springs that have been seen, but the four blade spring in the 38 era 81 I have can't be an original or proper replacement due to the excessive length when compressed.

T/W Wiesner's yesterday, they advised out of stock of 8/81 springs and don't anticipate any further production. The metal leaf's remind me of metal banding I've seen over the years used for shipping containment. If push comes to shove might have to try and fabricate a spring by cutting metal banding to length, riveting the ends (if possible), and forming proper bends in the leaves. ??? if will work.
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Phyrbird
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Re: 81 Magazine Rx

Post by Phyrbird »

Rifleman
The late model 81s had bent springs, not riveted. The late bent springs work well in all my experience in all rifles. Decades ago I made some leaf springs to repair an old rimfire drop block rifle. Time consuming & nerve wracking at best, you gotta love it.
Know this; it took 3 tries to get the heat treat & tempering right on the hacksaw blade material I had for stock. The first snapped the little hook off the hammer end. The 2nd was too soft & bent installing. After re treating the straightened bend it worked OK. With no 5mm rimfire ammo to test the operation we ended up trading the rifle later so I have no idea how well my fab performed over time.
FleaBay has these from time to time, be cautious, many of the riveted springs are already damaged & need close inspection if they can be used. I do wish Wiesners could find a way to supply more
Phyrbird
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Rifleman
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Re: 81 Magazine Rx

Post by Rifleman »

Thanks Phyrbird. Wish Wiesners still offered also. Over the last couple of years I've seen several 8/81 springs for sale on the net, but never figured I'd need one. Should have grabbed one. Saw a post here on the forum posted around a year ago where someone ordered one from Wiesners, guess my need has come to late. The gal at Wiesners advised me that they would have to manufacture a certain quantity with no idea how they'd sale. Didn't want to tie up big investment on slow sales I assume.

Wonder why my '47 and '49 era 81's have the riveted springs if Remington was installing bent (non-riveted) springs in the late 81's. As I penned in my earlier post, there's no way the spring out of the '38 81 is stock Remington. The hunt continues. Appreciate any leads or for sale spring.
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